tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post5263872258425118323..comments2024-03-18T08:17:10.105-04:00Comments on The Irreverent Psychologist: Pretty in Pink: Two Vintage Chinese MenAnonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00437830556630350204noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-8650910272628212712014-03-30T10:04:45.358-04:002014-03-30T10:04:45.358-04:00Yes, they were. The interesting thing is how histo...Yes, they were. The interesting thing is how historical photographs communicate with us both what the photographer saw then as well as what we'd like to see now. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00437830556630350204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-7968676515629669832014-03-26T10:02:19.549-04:002014-03-26T10:02:19.549-04:00Oh boy. They were monks! Simple as that.Oh boy. They were monks! Simple as that.Solo Solohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06185071896391997990noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-39517774287057075362013-08-09T10:39:26.699-04:002013-08-09T10:39:26.699-04:00Hi Ralph,
I can't tell you the number of tim...Hi Ralph, <br /><br />I can't tell you the number of times I've gone on and on in a comment about an article, after having read the first paragraph, only to discover that had I read the article I wouldn't have been so fired up! :-)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00437830556630350204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-7244213935021240172013-08-08T18:11:51.074-04:002013-08-08T18:11:51.074-04:00Ah... yes, and Thank you, Jason. After reading the...Ah... yes, and Thank you, Jason. After reading the rest of your article, I'm a bit embarrassed and I humbly apologize for jumping to conclusions. I also agree with you that the good Baron did most of his image work in Japan, where he documented a much wider variety of "slice of life" a la orient. Cheers!ralph repohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06648253721289615867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-84639039791803065512013-08-08T16:14:19.897-04:002013-08-08T16:14:19.897-04:00Ralph,
Thanks for your comments. It's somewha...Ralph,<br /><br />Thanks for your comments. It's somewhat ironic that you encourage me to look at my implicit responses about an image in a post where I encourage the reader to look at their implicit responses to images. As I wrote, many people assume these men are gay because they are wearing pink: they are likely not gay. I am left to assume you read the first paragraph or two and responded to what you experienced before really reading what am wrote.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00437830556630350204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-21024276952443446932013-08-08T15:46:35.360-04:002013-08-08T15:46:35.360-04:00Oh, and BTW, the exact same calligraphy hangings b...Oh, and BTW, the exact same calligraphy hangings behind the two monks also appeared in several of the other photos from the Baron Raimund collection. Thus, I suspect they're nothing more than simple cultural props. IMHO, sometimes we look and want to see meaningful things that really aren't there in the first place.ralph repohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06648253721289615867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-70883893071124438222013-08-08T15:36:29.942-04:002013-08-08T15:36:29.942-04:00IMHO, I think your conjecture vis a vis pink robes...IMHO, I think your conjecture vis a vis pink robes and "gayness" is really a stretch. First off, the picture were taken in Black & White, as there wasn't any commercial color process in the 1870's. Secondly, whoever painted the robes (we naturally assume it's the shooter, but often it's not) chose that particular color for reasons that will be forever lost to history. It may have as much to do with artistic expression as visual accuracy, or to technical limitations of the craft of hand tinting. For example, dark hand tinted colors never really look good, so the artist may have chosen a lighter color instead. Moreover, if one looked upon the entire set of photographs in the Met collection, then the context dramatically changes; it now is apparent that these were all taken as representations of the "types" of Chinese people. The subjects in this case, were monks or other clerical workers. I don't see any convincing evidence that there was any forethought or intent by the photographer to record or depict gayness at all. ralph repohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06648253721289615867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-41047563308371352802013-06-03T11:16:17.813-04:002013-06-03T11:16:17.813-04:00Yes. It's a good mystery. It will be interesti...Yes. It's a good mystery. It will be interesting to see what turns up about the image. It showed up on the cover of a book of photography that was published in Europe (Germany? Netherlands?) a few years back.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00437830556630350204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-2921620561520209382013-06-02T22:51:39.176-04:002013-06-02T22:51:39.176-04:00What an interesting person Baron Raimund von Still...What an interesting person Baron Raimund von Stillfried is. All the photos are curiously beautiful.<br /><br />Aren't we a bunch of detectives? I'll be looking forward to hearing the replies.Shuko Tamaohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11359328837313017202noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-61547793216763254692013-06-02T20:24:35.988-04:002013-06-02T20:24:35.988-04:00Also of note, the record for the photograph at the...Also of note, the record for the photograph at the Met notes that on the reverse side of the image is a mostly illegible pencil marking with the initials B.R. -- wonder if that might be Baron Raimund?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00437830556630350204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-19509775348030902622013-06-02T20:18:40.444-04:002013-06-02T20:18:40.444-04:00I was hoping you'd see this, Shuko. I figured ...I was hoping you'd see this, Shuko. I figured you might point me in some interesting directions.<br /><br />The robes were most definitely hand colored. Since this photograph has been invested in at least twice (the original buyer, and then the Met), I'm going to assume curators have determined the coloring to be original.<br /><br />I should have looked into the meaning of the robe color on first posting the image -- thanks for pointing it out to me. <br /><br />So the kāṣāya is called jiāshā (袈裟) in Chinese Buddhism. A quick review online suggests that the common color of the robes were red. Later, the color of the jiāshā corresponded to the geographical region of the monk.<br /><br />What of the color pink? I can find one image of a woman in a pink kāṣāya. That's about it.<br /><br />http://www.flickr.com/photos/mytripsmypics/7108792905/<br /><br />I ventured into some Chinese language websites--there are numerous websites that have this picture listed. Here is an example:<br /><br />http://linkz.blog.163.com/blog/static/186970020126121048176/<br /><br />Of the 7 or 8 websites in Chinese that I looked at, all identified Baron Raimund von Stillfried as the photographer of the image. Stillfried seemed to, however, mostly work in Japan. I'm going to e-mail the curator at the Met to see if she/he might have some more information on this image.<br /><br />Inquiring minds want to know.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00437830556630350204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-56515426614587314912013-06-02T17:54:05.157-04:002013-06-02T17:54:05.157-04:00Certainly this picture can be interpreted in multi...Certainly this picture can be interpreted in multiple ways!<br /><br />The robes are painted, right? Who painted pink? Did the painter use the color what those two guys were actually wearing? Or did the painter use his (I assume it's "he") imagination?<br /><br />Those robes look like they are Buddhist monks. The color of robes (Kasaya) contains lots of messages to signify their identities as monks.<br /><br />I can't read the banner, bummer.Shuko Tamaohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11359328837313017202noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-19440207721351596072013-06-02T07:07:52.084-04:002013-06-02T07:07:52.084-04:00Thanks so much! How sad that the words are not rea...Thanks so much! How sad that the words are not readable. I guess for now our men in pink will remain mostly a mystery. <br /><br />It does look like the men are in a photo studio of some sorts. The backdrop appears to be a large piece of canvas that stretches from the front of the picture all the way up to the ceiling. The banners are hung on that. That bit suggests the men had this picture taken at some event, or to commemorate some event. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00437830556630350204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8975835436255022813.post-16279808093436783652013-06-02T00:53:55.883-04:002013-06-02T00:53:55.883-04:00Hi.. Nice blog you've got here.mI do speak and...Hi.. Nice blog you've got here.mI do speak and read Mandarin. The words behind are not readable, but Chinese often have these rolls of "banner" like things attached on walls of the houses. Most likely for deco. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15340345665223554395noreply@blogger.com